1 BEFORE THE CALIFORNIA STATE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION 2 450 N STREET 3 SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA 4 5 6 7 REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT 8 AUGUST 22, 2012 9 P OTHER ADMINSTRATIVE MATTERS 10 P5.3 BUDGET CHANGE PROPOSALS 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 Reported by: Juli Price Jackson 21 No. CSR 5214 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 1 1 P R E S E N T 2 3 For the Board Jerome E. Horton of Equalization: Chairman 4 5 Michelle Steel Vice-Chairwoman 6 7 Betty T. Yee Member 8 9 George Runner Member 10 11 Marcy Jo Mandel Appearing for John 12 Chiang, State Controller (per 13 Government Code Section 7.9) 14 15 Joann Richmond Chief, Board 16 Proceedings Division 17 18 For the Staff: Liz Houser Director 19 Administration 20 Susanne Buehler Chief 21 Tax Policy Division 22 ---oOo--- 23 24 25 26 27 28 2 1 450 N STREET 2 SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA 3 AUGUST 22, 2012 4 ---oOo--- 5 MS. HOUSER: My last item is the presentation 6 of our 2013-14 budget change proposals for Board 7 approval. We have five proposals before you today. 8 And, if it pleases the Board, I will present each 9 proposal, then take questions on that item and ask for 10 a motion to approve it before we proceed to the next 11 proposal. 12 MR. HORTON: So be it. 13 MS. HOUSER: The first proposal is the accounts 14 receivable growth BCP, which requests 106.4 positions 15 and $12.9 million in the first year, rising to 234.9 16 positions and 23.9 million in the fourth year and 17 ongoing. Revenues are estimated at 51 million the first 18 year, rising to 96 million ongoing. 19 Here with me today is Susanne Buehler, Chief of 20 Tax Policy, who will explain the three key elements of 21 this request. 22 MS. BUEHLER: Good afternoon, Chairman Horton 23 and Members. I am Susanne Buehler with the Sales and 24 Use Tax Department. 25 The first element of this BCP is referred to as 26 the collection program expansion. It includes 97.4 27 positions, 11.4 million in cost and estimated revenues 28 of 33.1 million in the first year. 3 1 This element includes the addition of 2 collection staff to help address our accounts 3 receivables and enable our taxpayers to work with our 4 collectors to make payment arrangements sooner. 5 It also includes funding for new training 6 software, an automatic phone dialing system that will 7 proactively remind taxpayers it is time to file their 8 return and provide new technology to field collectors to 9 enable them to accept credit card payments with mobile 10 devices. 11 The second element is referred to as expanding 12 E-Services. It includes six positions, $1.2 million in 13 cost and estimated revenues of 17.7 million in the first 14 year. 15 This element will provide enhanced customer 16 services for our taxpayers, enabling them to perform 17 account maintenance transactions online. Transactions 18 would include the ability to update their business 19 location, phone numbers, e-mail addresses, addresses, 20 et cetera. 21 Providing this capability online will, in turn, 22 free up staff time, which will, in turn, be used to 23 augment our collection program. 24 The final element is referred to as the 25 enhanced return review program. It includes three 26 positions, $324,000 in cost and estimated revenues of 27 594,000 in the first year. 28 Currently our return review program is very 4 1 time consuming and labor intensive as staff work each 2 return individually, researching multiple main frame 3 screens for information on an account. 4 This element will provide staff who will work 5 with large quantities of data from our main frame system 6 and using data analytic tools that we already have, 7 identify those accounts that are most productive for our 8 Return Analysis and Local Tax staff to work. This 9 methodology will allow our staff to proactively address 10 reporting errors made by taxpayers sooner, rather than 11 these errors becoming issues in audits three to four 12 years later. 13 That concludes my summary. And I would be 14 happy to address any questions you may have on this BCP. 15 MR. HORTON: Discussion, Members? 16 Member Yee. 17 MS. YEE: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. 18 I'm going to have a couple of questions. And I 19 may have missed it in the writeup, but I wanted to just 20 be clear in my own head about the accounts receivables 21 and how we talk about them. 22 I know that the justification for the growth, 23 in part, has been due to the economic downturn and, 24 certainly, more taxpayers not being able to keep up with 25 their responsibilities. But I also wanted to just be 26 clear in my own head about what we're doing in terms of 27 the timing of when we actually write off accounts. 28 I know it's been an issue in the past as to 5 1 whether we worked them, you know, thoroughly and over 2 what period of time before we actually then treat them 3 differently with respect to collections. 4 MS. BUEHLER: There is no set period of time 5 that staff uses to say, "After three years we're writing 6 it off." 7 We do look at other criteria, which I can 8 briefly go over with you. 9 MS. YEE: Uh-huh. 10 MS. BUEHLER: If a taxpayer is deceased, 11 there's no estate or the estate was already are 12 distributed, if the taxpayer cannot be located or is 13 located outside of our State jurisdiction and referral 14 to the Attorney General is not recommended, if there is 15 an inactive corporation, with no assets and no personal 16 liability for the officers, if there's a settlement in 17 accordance with the Attorney General, if the taxpayer 18 has no assets or income on which to levy or there's a 19 small balance that really just does not justify further 20 collection effort -- if any of those are occurring, 21 that's when we would be looking at writing off an 22 account. 23 MS. YEE: Okay. And then a related question, I 24 know when we had the collections task force a few years 25 ago and we worked with some of the field collectors, one 26 of the suggestions that had been raised -- and I don't 27 know that we ever considered the proposal fully -- is 28 what happens in the event where we have a taxpayer 6 1 that -- or who has -- has a business that has resulted 2 in a liability that now is part of this mix in terms of 3 working with us in this accounts receivable kind of 4 stage and then proceeds to then open up another 5 business, under either a different legal entity or, even 6 worse, in a related business. 7 Is there any that -- I remember that that was a 8 huge -- 9 MS. MANDEL: Did we do a bill? 10 MS. BUEHLER: There is a bill that did pass 11 last year. And it's one of the follow-up items we have 12 for our E-Reg system. 13 MS. YEE: Okay. 14 MS. BUEHLER: Kind of a second phase 15 enhancement that we could check if we have Joe Taxpayer 16 coming and our system would check, do they have an 17 existing account and are they in good standing with us 18 before we would issue another permit. 19 MS. YEE: Okay. 20 MS. BUEHLER: So, that is a planned second 21 phase for E-Registration. 22 MS. YEE: But that's not in place yet? 23 MS. BUEHLER: No, it's not. 24 MS. YEE: Okay, okay. So, any sense of timing 25 of when that might be. 26 MS. BUEHLER: No, I would have to get back to 27 you on that. 28 MS. YEE: Okay. 7 1 MS. BUEHLER: We have to work with our partners 2 in TSD to work out timing. 3 MS. YEE: All right. And then I guess in 4 element 3, expanding E-Services, there is a component of 5 this that I thought proposed to redirect some positions 6 from SUTD? 7 MS. BUEHLER: Yes. 8 MS. YEE: Okay. 9 MS. BUEHLER: I think it's roughly 24 and a 10 half positions. 11 MS. YEE: Right. Can you tell me where those 12 are coming from and what would not get done, if 13 anything? 14 MS. BUEHLER: These are primarily Tax Tech 15 positions, Tax Tech I and II, in the district offices 16 that would be doing account maintenance now manually 17 based on information either from a taxpayer coming in or 18 mailing in information to us. 19 Since the taxpayer would then be doing it 20 online and it would be automated, our hope is that we 21 would be able to reclassify these positions to Tax 22 Tech III positions and then they would be doing 23 collections for us. 24 MS. YEE: All right. And then, finally, on the 25 fourth element -- and maybe this is a question I should 26 have posed to Mr. Steen when he was up here -- I just 27 want to be sure that everything we are considering 28 relative to additional resources we're looking at with a 8 1 little bit of a long term view. And to the extent that 2 there are some functionalities that can be picked up by 3 CROS at some point down the road that we are -- we 4 acknowledge that as we see that possibility? 5 MS. BUEHLER: Yes, our Data Analysis staff does 6 work very closely with are Mr. Steen's group. Every 7 need that's coming up, we're sure to communicate and 8 make that CROS can handle what we're doing. 9 MS. YEE: Okay, all right. I think that's it, 10 thanks. 11 MR. HORTON: Okay, further discussion? 12 Mr. Runner. 13 MR. RUNNER: Yeah, just -- just to follow up on 14 some of the accounts receivable discussion. 15 What has been our current activity in regards 16 to determining and submitting? 'Cause I think we have 17 to submit our write-offs to the Controller's office, 18 correct? 19 MS. BUEHLER: That's correct. 20 MR. RUNNER: And how -- and how is -- for 21 instance, over the last year or two, have we been doing 22 that compared to, say, previous in terms of the amounts? 23 MS. BUEHLER: I would say over the last year or 24 two our amounts have decreased. As staff is dealing 25 with more and more accounts receivable, their focus has 26 turned more to bringing the collections in rather than 27 writing off the -- 28 MR. RUNNER: The amounts have decreased that 9 1 we're reporting to the Controller. 2 MS. BUEHLER: Uh-huh. 3 MR. RUNNER: Well, let me -- okay, hold on. 4 Let me -- that just -- and that -- does that -- you've 5 kind of indicated then that the ones in the past that we 6 have given to the Controller as write-offs, we were more 7 collectible? 8 MS. BUEHLER: No, I'm not saying that. 9 MR. RUNNER: Okay. Because I thought what I 10 heard you say was the fact that we are holding them 11 longer because we think they can be collected on? 12 MS. BUEHLER: No, what I'm saying is that the 13 caseload for our collectors has grown so large that 14 they're unable to deal with every case on -- every case 15 on their work list. 16 So, they're -- the tendency for staff is to 17 work the ones they know they can bring money into the 18 State because everyone knows the State is in dire need 19 of having revenues come in. 20 MR. RUNNER: Right. 21 MS. BUEHLER: Rather than going, 22 "Okay, I know this one is now uncollectible 23 and I need to go through the process of writing 24 it off and sending it over to State 25 Controller." 26 MR. RUNNER: Well, I would -- okay, I get -- 27 that makes sense. I guess my concern is in doing that, 28 though, it appears that we are growing in our accounts 10 1 receivable, right? 2 MS. BUEHLER: It does impact that, yes. 3 MR. RUNNER: And it seems to me that part of 4 the process in terms of that would be to try to move off 5 things as soon as we can to get them off our plate so 6 that we don't appear to have a growing accounts 7 receivable. 8 Because oftentimes then when the people look at 9 the State's accounts receivable, whether it's BOE or FTB 10 or whoever is, they say, "Aha, why don't we go get that 11 money?" 12 If the answer is a portion of that money is not 13 collectible -- 14 MS. BUEHLER: That's correct. 15 MR. RUNNER: -- then we're not really giving 16 them a realistic number. So, maybe one of the 17 priorities with new people coming in should be the idea 18 of making sure that we actually have accurate account 19 receivable numbers in regards to that. 20 Let me -- because, again, what that means is we 21 actually have accounts that we're not working, right 22 now? 23 MS. BUEHLER: That's correct. 24 MR. RUNNER: Is that fair? 25 MS. BUEHLER: Uh-huh. 26 MR. RUNNER: And I think we ought to kind of 27 get them off our plate. 28 Let me ask also then in regards to this, have 11 1 we -- how are doing -- well, from what I've heard and 2 what I'm seeing is that we're doing a more aggressive 3 job and successful in regards to getting -- moving 4 people to installment plans? 5 MS. BUEHLER: That's correct. 6 MR. RUNNER: And just for the record, though, 7 if somebody is in an installment plan, that number still 8 hangs out there as accounts receivable, correct? 9 MS. BUEHLER: That's correct, until it's paid 10 off in full. 11 MR. RUNNER: Okay. It would be an interesting 12 number, I think, for us all to see how many agreements 13 we've had that are actually in agreement now to pay for 14 us, you know, with an -- with an agreement versus those 15 that are accounts receivable who we would say, in my 16 mind when we have an accounts receivable, it's somebody 17 who made -- who owes us money and we don't have an 18 agreement with them. 19 So, it would be interesting to see 'cause I 20 don't -- just for us to say, "Hey, we may have an 21 accounts receivable of X, but we also have agreements of 22 that accounts receivable in a payment plan of X." 23 So, maybe that would be -- that would be 24 helpful at that point. 25 The other issue in the new -- the new 26 collectors coming on, is there any thought to changing 27 in regards to collection, I guess, tech -- I don't want 28 to say technique or procedures, I'll get specific. 12 1 For instance, call -- right now our collectors 2 basically make contact during BOE business hours, 3 correct? 4 MS. BUEHLER: Correct. 5 MR. RUNNER: So, we don't, you know, for a lot 6 of folks -- so, we don't do like calls at -- to 7 businesses or numbers that we have, say, at 6:30 or 7:30 8 at night? 9 MS. BUEHLER: That's correct. 10 MR. RUNNER: Or on Saturdays or on weekends? 11 MS. BUEHLER: Right. 12 MR. RUNNER: Is there any thought to 13 potentially looking at that as an opportunity where -- 14 particularly if we keep calling the same number, say at 15 10 o'clock every morning and then we try 11 o'clock 16 every morning, then we try 1 o'clock every morning and 17 we keep leaving messages, that we would at least have 18 some of those that would be available to make phone 19 calls, say, at off times? 20 And again, I'm not talking about at 11:30 at 21 night, I'm just talking about, you know, 6:30, 7:30 in 22 the evening or on Saturdays, that we would actually try 23 to make calls during that particular time in order to 24 kind of open up our ability to make contact to those who 25 we're trying to collect from? 26 MS. BUEHLER: It's certainly something we could 27 consider, yes. 28 MR. RUNNER: Okay. I think it ought to be 13 1 something we explore and deal with that because, again, 2 it's one of those issues to where it -- it makes sense 3 to me, particularly if people are having a hard time 4 contacting them, we just can get them at different 5 times. 6 Because, again, I -- you know, the instant 7 place we go to sometimes is we say, "Oh, but that's so 8 intrusive, we don't want to go to them at the dinner 9 time," and those kind of issues. 10 But the problem is if we don't get a hold of 11 them, potentially we're just going to go ahead and take 12 money out of their bank account. And I can tell you, 13 that's a whole lot more intrusive than a phone call at 14 dinner. 15 And, so, I just would suggest that might be 16 something we might want to look at. 17 Thanks. 18 MR. HORTON: Further discussion, Members? 19 Thank you very much for your presentation. And 20 we will receive and file. 21 MS. HOUSER: Okay. I do need an approval vote 22 on this. 23 MR. HORTON: Right. 24 MS. HOUSER: On this particular item I need to 25 know if you want to vote for the -- 26 MR. HORTON: 1, 2 or -- 27 MS. HOUSER: -- AR BCP as a whole or if you'd 28 like to vote on individual elements. There are three 14 1 elements to this BCP. 2 MR. HORTON: It appears that all three items 3 appear to be acceptable to the Members, unless there's 4 an objection? 5 MS. STEEL: Objection. 6 MR. HORTON: Objection noted. 7 We will take -- Ms. Steel, is there a motion 8 relative to the balance of the items. 9 MS. YEE: I'd move approval. 10 MR. HORTON: Which item? 11 MR. RUNNER: Which motion on which items? 12 MR. HORTON: All of them? 13 MS. YEE: Yeah, I was making a motion on all 14 three. 15 MR. HORTON: Okay. Member Yee moves adoption 16 of all three. 17 MS. STEEL: There's four -- four elements. 18 MS. HOUSER: No, there's three. 19 The second element, contracting out 20 collections, has been removed. 21 MS. STEEL: Oh, I see. 22 MS. HOUSER: And a revised BCP was sent to you 23 this morning. 24 MS. STEEL: Okay. 25 MS. HOUSER: So, the three provisions are the 26 collection program expansion, the expanding E-Services 27 and the enhanced return review program. 28 MR. HORTON: Ms. Steel? 15 1 MS. STEEL: Objection. 2 MR. HORTON: On? 3 MS. STEEL: On -- actually, you know, I like 4 the third elements now and the fourth, enhanced review 5 return program, because, you know, those though 6 taxpayers that they made the wrong practice, then, you 7 know, we can correct that. That I understand. 8 Expanding E-Services, I think that's six 9 positions, it cannot be permanent, it can be limited 10 positions. And that cost of $1.2 million, I really 11 cannot go for it. 12 And, of course, No. 1, 97.4 positions on those 13 that noncollectible, you know, the accounts receivable 14 that I really cannot go for it. 15 MR. HORTON: Okay. 16 MS. STEEL: So, if we vote for 1 and 2 17 together, I object. 18 And No. 3, I vote for it. 19 MR. HORTON: Okay. Member Steel moves -- 20 with -- Member Yee, with your permission, Member Steel 21 moves adoption of item No. 3, second by Member Yee. 22 Without objection, Members, such will be the 23 order. 24 Member Yee moves adoption of item 1 and 2, 25 second by Member Mandel. 26 Ms. Richmond, please call the roll. 27 MS. MANDEL: Wait, wait -- 28 MR. HORTON: There's -- 16 1 MS. MANDEL: -- I'm confused which ones we're 2 talking about. 3 MR. HORTON: -- item 3 has -- 4 MS. MANDEL: Is the enhanced -- 5 MS. HOUSER: Enhanced return review program. 6 MS. BUEHLER: Yeah. 7 MS. HOUSER: And then items 1 and 2 is the 8 collection program expansion and expanding E-Services. 9 MR. HORTON: Okay. So, any objection on 1 or 10 2, Members? 11 MS. STEEL: Yes, objection. 12 MR. HORTON: I mean other than Member Steel? 13 MR. RUNNER: I'm staying off of item 1. 14 MR. HORTON: Mr. Runner, so noted on item 1. 15 Okay, let's take up item No. 2. Any objection 16 to item No. 2? 17 MS. STEEL: Objection. 18 MR. HORTON: Other than Member Steel? 19 Okay, so noted. 20 Member Yee moves adoption of item No. 2. 21 Strike that. 22 Yeah, Member Yee moves adoption of item No. 2, 23 second by Member Mandel. Noted objection by Member 24 Steel. 25 Ms. Richmond, please call the roll. 26 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Horton? 27 MR. HORTON: Aye. 28 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Steel? 17 1 MS. STEEL: No. 2 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Runner? 3 MR. RUNNER: Aye. 4 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Yee? 5 MS. YEE: Aye. 6 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Mandel? 7 MS. MANDEL: Aye. 8 MS. RICHMOND: Motion carries. 9 MR. HORTON: Member Yee moves to adoption of 10 item No. 1, second by Member Mandel, noted objection by 11 Member Runner and Steel. 12 Ms. Richmond, please call the roll. 13 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Horton? 14 MR. HORTON: Aye. 15 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Steel? 16 MS. STEEL: No. 17 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Runner? 18 MR. RUNNER: Not voting. 19 MS. RICHMOND: Pardon me? 20 MR. RUNNER: Not voting. 21 MS. MANDEL: Not voting. 22 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Yee? 23 MS. YEE: Aye. 24 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Mandel? 25 MS. MANDEL: Aye. 26 MS. RICHMOND: Motion carries. 27 MR. HORTON: Okay, Ms. Houser. 28 MS. HOUSER: Okay. The next BCP is the fuel 18 1 tax swap refund workload. It requests $506,000 to 2 permanently establish that, being to meet the statutory 3 requirements and address the more complex and time 4 consuming workload created by the annual fuel tax rate 5 adjustment in the Special Taxes and Motor Carrier 6 Division. 7 MR. HORTON: Thank you. Discussion, Members? 8 Hearing none, is there a motion? 9 MS. YEE: I move approval. 10 MR. HORTON: Moved by Member Yee, second by -- 11 MS. STEEL: Second. 12 MR. HORTON: -- Member Steel. 13 Without objection, Members, such will be the 14 order. 15 Thank you very much. 16 MS. HOUSER: The next item is the FI$Cal 17 Implementation Resource. It requests 13.2 limited term 18 positions at a cost of $1,732,000 to provide BOE with 19 the necessary resources to plan, prepare and interface 20 with the FI$Cal Statewide project. 21 We are currently scheduled as part of the first 22 wave of the project. 23 MR. HORTON: Thank you very much. Discussion, 24 Members? 25 Member Yee. 26 MS. YEE: I guess not really on point to this, 27 but it did raise a couple of questions for me about the 28 recent activities around Special Funds reconciliation. 19 1 And I know part of this effort is to try to 2 have better tools with respect to reporting, you know, 3 revenues coming into the State, among other things. But 4 as a collector of numerous revenues and special taxes 5 and fees for other departments and agencies, did we play 6 any role in terms of that whole special funds 7 reconciliation effort by the Department of Finance? 8 And did we -- and is there a role for us to 9 play as a collector? 10 MS. HOUSER: Not -- this is in regard to 11 FI$Cal, this is in regard to the -- 12 MS. YEE: Just the -- 13 MS. HOUSER: -- just the special fund 14 reconciliation? 15 Not at this point -- now, we do, you know, BSA 16 audits our special funds every year and that report goes 17 over to Finance. So, they're very familiar with our end 18 of the fund as far how much went over. 19 I would think that reconciliation is probably 20 on the receiving end of who the funds went to. But -- 21 but at this point we haven't been asked to have a more 22 meaningful role in that reconciliation. 23 MS. YEE: Okay. I just was a little alarmed 24 when I saw some of the funds that we collect revenues -- 25 MS. HOUSER: Reserves. 26 MS. YEE: -- yeah. 27 MS. HOUSER: Yes. 28 MS. YEE: Okay. 20 1 MS. HOUSER: We've had the opportunity to speak 2 with some of those funds also on how much money they 3 received. 4 MS. YEE: Okay, thank you. 5 MS. HOUSER: Thank you. 6 MR. HORTON: Further discussion, Members? 7 MS. HOUSER: I need approval. 8 MR. HORTON: Is there a motion? 9 MS. YEE: Move approval. 10 MR. HORTON: Moved by Member Yee, second -- 11 MS. STEEL: I have objection. 12 MR. HORTON: -- objection noted by Member 13 Steel. Second by Member Mandel. 14 Ms. Richmond, please call the roll. 15 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Horton? 16 MR. HORTON: Aye. 17 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Steel? 18 MS. STEEL: No. 19 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Runner? 20 MR. RUNNER: Aye. 21 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Yee? 22 MS. YEE: Aye. 23 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Mandel? 24 MS. MANDEL: Aye. 25 MS. RICHMOND: That motion carries. 26 MS. HOUSER: Thank you. 27 The next is the headquarters facility 28 consolidation. This is our annual request for $500,000 21 1 and the authority to relocate BOE's headquarters and our 2 headquarter annex facilities into one consolidated 3 location that will meet our business needs. 4 This will fund the initial planning costs that 5 we would incur from DGS. 6 MR. HORTON: Discussion, Members? 7 MS. STEEL: So moved. 8 MR. HORTON: Moved by Member Steel, second by 9 Member Yee. 10 Without objection, Members, such will be the 11 order. 12 MS. HOUSER: Thank you. 13 Our last item is a placeholder BCP. As I 14 mentioned earlier, we are responsible for paying for the 15 repairs to the 450 N Street building. This will serve 16 as a placeholder in the event that additional funds are 17 needed for the repairs of this building. 18 We have -- we've already paid for the spandrel 19 glass, but we're not sure what the pipe repairs would 20 cost. And this -- it's very prudent for BOE to have 21 this as a mechanism in case additional funding or 22 repairs are needed. 23 MR. HORTON: Is there a motion, Members? 24 Moved by Member -- 25 MS. STEEL: No, no, I -- 26 MR. HORTON: -- Ms. Steel. 27 MS. STEEL: -- I object because we have a 28 deficit. And, you know, we tried to set aside money, 22 1 something that I understand that there is, you know, 2 pipe -- pipe problem and other stuffs. 3 But we spent over $60 million for this building 4 to -- that's -- DGS knows that they are going to -- 5 that, you know, it's going to cost much, much more and 6 then, you know, we can -- if we had those millions of 7 dollars, actually, we can rent other building, making 8 downpayment -- not even buying it. We can just lease 9 out from other buildings. 10 So, this is just getting -- going totally wrong 11 direction, but I really cannot vote for something that 12 money has to be set aside -- 13 MS. HOUSER: And I -- 14 MS. STEEL: -- at this point. 15 MS. HOUSER: -- and I understand where you're 16 coming from Ms. Steel, but a couple of years ago, the -- 17 MR. HORTON: My apologies, I believe that was a 18 statement, not a question. 19 MS. HOUSER: Oh, I'm sorry. 20 MS. STEEL: But -- Member Steel? 21 MS. STEEL: We can talk later -- 22 MS. HOUSER: Okay, thank you. 23 MS. STEEL: -- about this, yeah. 24 MR. HORTON: Further discussion, Members? 25 Hearing none, a noted objection by Member 26 Steel, moved by Member Yee, second by Member Runner, 27 without -- Ms. Richmond, please call the roll. 28 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Horton? 23 1 MR. HORTON: Aye. 2 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Steel? 3 MS. STEEL: No. 4 MS. RICHMOND: Mr. Runner? 5 MR. RUNNER: Aye. 6 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Yee? 7 MS. YEE: Aye. 8 MS. RICHMOND: Ms. Mandel? 9 MS. MANDEL: Aye. 10 MS. RICHMOND: Motion carries. 11 MS. HOUSER: Than concludes my presentation. 12 Thank you much. 13 MS. RICHMOND: That concludes our 14 administrative session. 15 ---o0o--- 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 24 1 REPORTER'S CERTIFICATE. 2 3 State of California ) 4 ) ss 5 County of Sacramento ) 6 7 I, JULI PRICE JACKSON, Hearing Reporter for the 8 California State Board of Equalization certify that on 9 AUGUST 22, 2012 I recorded verbatim, in shorthand, to 10 the best of my ability, the proceedings in the 11 above-entitled hearing; that I transcribed the shorthand 12 writing into typewriting; and that the preceding pages 1 13 through 24 constitute a complete and accurate 14 transcription of the shorthand writing. 15 16 Dated: SEPTEMBER 26, 2012 17 18 19 ____________________________ 20 JULI PRICE JACKSON 21 Hearing Reporter 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 25