1 BEFORE THE CALIFORNIA STATE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION 2 450 N STREET 3 SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA 4 5 6 7 8 REPORTER'S TRANSCRIPT 9 DECEMBER 15, 2011 10 11 SALES AND USE TAX APPEAL HEARING 12 APPEAL OF 13 C5 PHUONG THANH KIM AND VAN THANH NGUYEN 14 NO. 505991(CH) 15 AGAINST PROPOSED ASSESSMENT OF 16 SALES AND USE TAX 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 Reported by: Kathleen Skidgel 28 CSR No. 9039 1 1 P R E S E N T 2 For the Board Jerome E. Horton of Equalization: Chairman 3 4 Michelle Steel Vice-Chairwoman 5 6 Betty T. Yee Member 7 8 Marcy Jo Mandel Appearing for John 9 Chiang, State Controller (per Government Code 10 Section 7.9) 11 Diane G. Olson 12 Chief Board Proceedings Division 13 14 For Board of David Levine Equalization Staff: Tax Counsel IV 15 16 For the Department: Scott Lambert Hearing Representative 17 Robert Tucker 18 Tax Counsel IV 19 Kevin Hanks Chief, Headquarters 20 Operations Division 21 Interpreter: Thao Nguyen 22 23 For Petitioner: Phuong Thanh Kim Taxpayer 24 25 ---oOo--- 26 27 28 2 1 450 N STREET 2 SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA 3 DECEMBER 15, 2011 4 ---oOo--- 5 MR. HORTON: Ms. Olson. 6 MS. OLSON: Our next item is P5, Phuong Thanh 7 Kim and Van Tan Nguyen. 8 Please come forward. 9 MR. HORTON: Mr. Levine, would you please 10 introduce the issues in this case. 11 MR. LEVINE: Yes. First, let me explain that 12 this is going to be a matter with full interpretation. 13 We have a Vietnamese interpreter, one of our employees, 14 Thao Nguyen, here who will do a full interpretation. So 15 that means that there's going to be a couple sentences 16 at a time and give time for the interpreter to 17 interpret. Maybe the taxpayer will feel more 18 comfortable later, but we'll at least be starting with 19 full interpretation. 20 The issues in this petition are whether 21 adjustments to the audited deficiency are warranted and 22 whether petitioner was negligent. 23 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 24 (Mr. Levine speaking to Interpreter Thao 25 Nguyen.) 26 MR. HORTON: Mr. Levine, um, because of the -- 27 the translation, I would ask that any communication 28 be -- 3 1 MR. LEVINE: Okay. I was just trying to 2 explain, ask her to tell the taxpayer that she needs to 3 do the same thing, speak a couple sentences and then you 4 translate. 5 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 6 THE INTERPRETER: She said that -- 7 MR. HORTON: Ms. Nguyen, thank you for your 8 assistance. 9 Could you please speak into the mike, just so 10 that it's recorded. 11 THE INTERPRETER: Oh, okay. 12 She said that the sale that she made in 2006 13 and 2007 is far different from the sale that she make 14 now. And she did not agree with the total tax that we, 15 um, ask her to pay. 16 MR. HORTON: Okay. Thank you. 17 For the record, we're going to allow 15 to 20 18 minutes, uh, for the taxpayer. And we would ask that 19 she commence with her introduction first. 20 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 21 THE INTERPRETER: We don't need introduction 22 now, right? 23 MR. LEVINE: Yes, you need to translate 24 everything that's said. 25 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 26 MS. KIM: Oh, okay. My name Phuong Thanh 27 Kim. 28 MR. HORTON: Welcome. 4 1 THE INTERPRETER: She doesn't know what to 2 do. 3 MR. LEVINE: Go ahead. Do your presentation -- 4 make your argument, couple sentences at a time. 5 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 6 THE INTERPRETER: In 2006 and 2007 my mom were 7 very sick and I did not sell a lot. Um, however, I pay 8 all the tax that I need to pay. 9 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 10 THE INTERPRETER: In 2012 -- in 2010, there 11 is -- there was a lady came to ask me how much I sell a 12 day, and I said that it's between 180 and 250. And now 13 you use that amount to say that that much I sell in 2006 14 and 2007, and I did not agree. 15 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 16 THE INTERPRETER: I don't have the 23,000 to 17 pay. I can only pay $1,200 for the 2005 and 2006 tax. 18 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 19 THE INTERPERTER: If you do not agree, then you 20 can take my lunch car because I have no way to continue 21 business. 22 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 23 THE INTERPRETER: I don't have that big of 24 money to pay you. 25 MR. HORTON: Does that conclude her 26 presentation? 27 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 28 THE INTERPRETER: Uh, she -- that's all I need 5 1 to say. And, um -- um, for now. There is a contest at 2 where she -- she park her car and sell. And she didn't 3 make any sale at all. 4 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 5 THE INTERPRETER: If I cannot make any sale, 6 how could I have money to pay the tax? 7 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 8 THE INTERPRETER: You cannot say that I make 9 the same amount of sales every day. 10 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 11 THE INTERPERTER: There is up and down. There 12 is no same amount every day. And today I could not make 13 any sale because of the projects on the street. 14 And that's all. 15 MR. HORTON: Thank you very much. 16 We will now go to the Department and they will 17 have 10 minutes to make their presentation. And then we 18 will return to the taxpayer and she will have five 19 minutes to dispute, uh, argue, or discuss their 20 presentation. 21 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 22 THE INTERPRETER: Let me, um -- 23 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 24 MR. HORTON: Can you also share with us the 25 thoughts that she, uh -- statements she previously made? 26 THE INTERPRETER: Oh, she -- she say again 27 about the sale that she make. She don't make enough 28 sales. 6 1 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 2 THE INTERPERTER: Oh, um, I wrote, um -- on the 3 sales journal, I wrote the amount that I sell every 4 day. 5 MR. HORTON: Okay. 6 Department will have 10 minutes to make their 7 presentation. Uh, please commence with your 8 introductions. 9 MR. LAMBERT: Thank you, Chairman Horton. 10 My name is Scott Lambert. To my right is Kevin 11 Hanks, and to his right is Robert Tucker. We're all 12 representing staff. 13 In this particular case, the Department did not 14 have what we consider to be adequate records in order to 15 conduct the audit. We, therefore, tried to get in 16 contact with the taxpayer to, um, get her route and also 17 conduct a site test so we could see what her business 18 actually, uh, represented. And we were unsuccessful 19 in -- in our contact attempts, uh, either through phone 20 or e-mail or by letter. We also used -- I'm sorry -- an 21 interpreter to, um, obtain the information. 22 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 23 THE INTERPRETER: My phone is -- wasn't 24 working. That's why, um, I did not -- I could not, um, 25 call you back. 26 MR. LEVINE: Can -- can you explain to her that 27 she'll have a -- this is just the Department's 28 opportunity to present its case. So she just listens. 7 1 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 2 MR. LEVINE: Then she'll have another chance. 3 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 4 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 5 MR. HORTON: We -- we still want the 6 translation of their presentation. Okay. 7 MR. LAMBERT: So at this point, uh, the 8 Department would be willing to conduct a site test if 9 the taxpayer is -- or cooperates with the Department. 10 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 11 MR. LAMBERT: So, um, if the taxpayer is 12 willing to, uh, provide us with the route and allow us 13 to, um, oversee some of her sales, the Department is 14 willing to do that. 15 Um, so accordingly, the Department concurs with 16 the Appeals Division's decision and recommendation. 17 MR. HORTON: Okay. 18 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 19 MR. HORTON: On rebuttal. Now it's her 20 opportunity to -- 21 THE INTERPRETER: Now is her opportunity? 22 MR. HORTON: -- speak. 23 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 24 THE INTERPRETER: I allow you to come to my 25 route and observe what I sells. But I did not agree to 26 pay the 2005 and 2006 sales based on the current 27 sales. 28 MR. HORTON: Okay. Thank you very much. 8 1 Discussion, Members? 2 MS. STEEL: I have -- 3 MS. MANDEL: I have a question, too. 4 MR. HORTON: Um -- 5 MS. STEEL: Go ahead. 6 MR. HORTON: Ms. Mandel. 7 MS. MANDEL: She said that in 2005 and 2006 -- 8 THE INTERPRETER: '06/'07. 9 MS. MANDEL: '06/'07. Thank you. 2006 and 10 2007 that her mother was ill. 11 THE INTERPRETER: Mm-hmm. 12 MS. MANDEL: And so she did not make as many 13 sales. 14 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 15 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 16 MS. MANDEL: Right? 17 THE INTERPRETER: Yeah. 18 MS. MANDEL: Okay. Um, can she explain, uh -- 19 I understand that to mean that she was taking care of 20 her mother or at the hospital or something, that she was 21 not, um, driving the -- taking the truck around and 22 working from the truck. So she did not work with the 23 truck all of the days. 24 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 25 MS. MANDEL: Is that right? 26 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 27 THE INTERPRETER: I only do, uh, three hours a 28 day, and not every day. 9 1 MS. MANDEL: During when her mother was sick? 2 THE INTERPRETER: Yeah. 3 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 4 THE INTERPRETER: My mom is very sick. She 5 could not live by herself. 6 MS. MANDEL: Okay. And that's -- 7 THE INTERPRETER: I'm sorry. 8 MS. MANDEL: Go ahead. 9 THE INTERPRETER: And she is still in the 10 hospital. 11 MS. MANDEL: Still? 12 THE INTERPRETER: Yes. 13 MS. MANDEL: But it was 2006 and 2007 that 14 she -- that, um, Petitioner did not, uh, work on the 15 truck as much as in the later -- 2008 and the beginning 16 of 2009? 17 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 18 THE INTERPRETER: 2008 and 2009 she sell 19 normally. 20 MS. MANDEL: I'm sorry. Say that again. 21 THE INTERPRETER: She, uh -- she sell normal. 22 MS. MANDEL: Sell normally in '08 and '09? 23 THE INTERPRETER: Yes. 24 MS. MANDEL: Okay. Thank you. 25 THE INTERPRETER: You're welcome. 26 MR. HORTON: Thank you. 27 Member Steel. 28 MS. STEEL: Um, is this one-person truck? 10 1 She's the only one? She drives and she cooks and she 2 gets, you know, paid and everything? 3 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 4 THE INTERPRETER: It is a one-person truck, uh, 5 in 2006 and 2007. 6 MS. STEEL: Okay. 7 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 8 THE INTERPRETER: 2008/2009 I have a helper. 9 MS. STEEL: Okay. Um, the reported sales was 10 $110 per day. But she just told us during the first, 11 um, you know, when she was explaining about her case, 12 that she said her sales were 160 to 200. Is that 13 because of the average that she couldn't -- I mean she 14 missed a few days because of her mom, 2006 and 2007? 15 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 16 THE INTERPRETER: Um, she said when -- when did 17 I say about 160 and 200? 18 MS. STEEL: Right. But she reported total 19 sales, daily average was $110. So I'm asking that 20 because of her mom was sick that she didn't go to work 21 every day or she missed few days, that's the reason. Or 22 she missed, you know, time during the day, that's the 23 reason that average came down do $110. 24 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 25 THE INTERPRETER: Yes. 26 MS. STEEL: Okay. Um, Department wants to do 27 observation test. Is she willing to give the route 28 that, you know, where she is going around during the 11 1 daytime? 2 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 3 THE INTERPRETER: Yeah. 4 MS. STEEL: Good. 5 Um, to the Department, that this is from the 6 SCOOP Program to audit. And when they went out, as you 7 know, she doesn't speak English at all. And then, 8 according to the Department that, um, she told SCOOP 9 person, investigator, that sales were in the range of 10 300 to $350 in daily, per day. 11 It doesn't make any sense to me how they can 12 communicate with this taxpayer when they went out. 13 That's my first question. 14 Second one is, what's the SCOOP Program 15 exactly? Because this is the things that I was afraid 16 when we let you -- we passed that SCOOP Program to go 17 out and find the sales tax permits. I thought that was 18 the main thing. But that create the audit without 19 really understanding what she was talking about. 20 So that's -- you know, I'm not really happy 21 about. 22 MR. LAMBERT: Okay. I can -- I'll explain this 23 situation and then I can, um -- I believe give you a 24 general overview of SCOOP. 25 In this particular situation, they -- one of 26 the SCOOP inspectors did encounter her at one of the 27 catering houses that she was there purchasing. And they 28 did talk to her, uh, in English at that particular time. 12 1 But they did -- sorry. 2 THE INTERPRETER: Do I need to interpret? 3 MR. LEVINE: Yes. 4 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 5 THE INTERPRETER: I can speak a little English 6 with my customer. 7 MR. HORTON: Okay. 8 MS. STEEL: You know, actually, I'm trying to 9 help her here. And, you know, just -- I want to hear 10 from the Department. So you can just translate. 11 MR. LEVINE: Is she saying that she can 12 understand -- 13 THE INTERPRETER: Uh-huh. 14 MR. LEVINE: She can understand and doesn't 15 need the translating to her? 16 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 17 MR. LEVINE: No. Is that what she's saying? 18 MS. STEEL: Can you ask her that she 19 understands English and she doesn't need translator? 20 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 21 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 22 THE INTERPRETER: No. 23 MS. STEEL: No. Okay. Good. 24 So just translate, and then let her listen if 25 you can. 26 MS. KIM: I can understand everything, 27 little. 28 THE INTERPRETER: She still needs translation 13 1 for everything. 2 MR. LEVINE: The Board Members will make it 3 clear when they'd like her to talk. 4 THE INTERPRETER: They'd like her to talk? 5 MR. LEVINE: No. They'll ask her. When it's 6 her turn to talk, they'll ask. 7 THE INTERPRETER: Yes. 8 MR. LEVINE: So explain to her -- 9 MS. MANDEL: She should just listen to your 10 translation. 11 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 12 MS. MANDEL: And -- and she can wait. If the 13 Members have a question for her, they'll ask her a 14 question. 15 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 16 MS. MANDEL: Right? 17 MR. HORTON: Mm-hmm. 18 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 19 THE INTERPRETER: Okay. 20 MS. STEEL: I even forgot what my question was 21 here. 22 MR. LAMBERT: I remember. 23 MR. HANKS: We'll follow it. 24 MS. STEEL: Okay. 25 MR. LAMBERT: So I'll just speak slowly or -- 26 and there's no interpretation, is that -- 27 MR. HORTON: No. There still is. 28 MR. LAMBERT: Okay. I'll just speak slowly and 14 1 stop. 2 After the SCOOP inspection a, um, BOE employee 3 that speaks Vietnamese called and spoke to the taxpayer 4 on the phone. 5 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 6 MR. HORTON: Continue. 7 MR. LAMBERT: There -- the understanding was 8 that the BOE employee went over the information that was 9 received in regards to the sales, and that there was an 10 underreporting; and basically told the taxpayer that 11 you've been underreporting your sales and we're going 12 to, um, propose an adjustment. 13 MR. HORTON: Okay. 14 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 15 MR. HORTON: Continue. 16 MR. LAMBERT: So at -- my understanding is at 17 that point there -- there was an understanding that she 18 agreed with what our interpreter, the BOE employee, had 19 spoken with her. And, therefore, that's when -- 20 MS. STEEL: Investigator, not interpreter. 21 MR. LAMBERT: No. Well, um, you know, I don't 22 know whether it was -- I don't know what her connection 23 was with the -- 24 MS. STEEL: Somebody was there who speaks 25 Vietnamese? 26 MR. LAMBERT: She spoke Vietnamese. It was the 27 person that -- it was a BOE employee that -- 28 MR. HORTON: Excuse me. 15 1 MR. LAMBERT: -- spoke Vietnamese. 2 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 3 MR. HORTON: Continue. 4 MR. LAMBERT: I'm not sure what her connection, 5 whether she was part of SCOOP. Um, I assume she was not 6 an auditor, um, but was involved -- was a BOE employee. 7 MR. HORTON: Okay. 8 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 9 MR. HORTON: Continue. 10 MR. LAMBERT: At that point, after the 11 discussion, the information was then transferred to a 12 BOE auditor that was connected with the SCOOP Program. 13 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 14 MS. STEEL: During the audit that, um, they 15 never really heard about that her mom was sick and then 16 she was not really working full-time at that point? 17 MR. HORTON: Please translate. 18 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 19 MR. HORTON: Respond. 20 MR. LAMBERT: There's no evidence in the file 21 that that was discussed. 22 MS. STEEL: Okay. 23 MR. HORTON: Please translate. 24 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 25 MR. HORTON: Member Steel. 26 MS. STEEL: My question is, if you wanted an 27 observation test, how are you going to adjust this? 28 Because she was not working full-time at that point. 16 1 Now her mom is in the hospital, so somebody's taking 2 care of her. So how you going to adjust that? 3 MR. LAMBERT: I guess the -- 4 MR. HORTON: Please translate. 5 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 6 MR. HORTON: Respond. 7 MR. LAMBERT: My question would be, what -- 8 what was the difference between '06 and '07, and then 9 what took place afterwards? In other words, in '08 and 10 '09, uh, I would assume, and it's an assumption, that 11 her mother was still sick and, um -- so there's some 12 questions. 13 MS. STEEL: Well, that's difference between -- 14 MR. HORTON: Translate. 15 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 16 MR. HORTON: Member Steel. 17 MS. STEEL: No, actually, I can ask you that, 18 you know, what happened that you said sales went up 2008 19 and 2000 -- 2008 and 2009, now, so you have an 20 assistant. You used to have only one-person truck at 21 that time, 2006 and 2007. So what's the difference 22 right now? 23 MS. KIM: No, I can say -- 24 MR. HORTON: Trans -- oh. Please. 25 MS. KIM: Because 2005 -- six, 2005 -- seven, 26 my mom sick. But 2008 and '09, now my mom feel better 27 now. My -- now my mom is stay home, not hospital. 28 MS. STEEL: At that time? 17 1 MS. KIM: Yeah. 2 MS. STEEL: Now your mom is in the hospital. 3 MS. KIM: No. Stay home. But only one month 4 or two month go to the doctor. Not the hospital. 5 MS. STEEL: Okay. So she's getting better -- 6 MS. KIM: Yeah. 7 MS. STEEL: -- that's why her business got 8 better and you're working. 9 MS. KIM: Yeah. Now my mom's better now. 10 MS. STEEL: So how we going to adjust that when 11 you do the observation test? 12 MR. HORTON: Shall we continue the translation? 13 MS. STEEL: It sounds like she -- 14 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 15 MS. KIM: What you ask me now? 16 MS. STEEL: I'm asking. 17 MR. HORTON: Translate, please. 18 THE INTERPRETER: What do you want to ask me 19 now? That's what she said. 20 MS. STEEL: No, I'm asking -- 21 THE INTERPRETER: I asked her if she needs 22 translate, and then she say, What do you want to ask me 23 now? 24 MS. STEEL: I'm not asking her a question. I'm 25 asking to the Department. You just translate that, you 26 know, for me. That one. 27 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 28 MR. LAMBERT: I guess my first response would 18 1 be I'd want to verify what -- what she's saying. But 2 given that's the case, um, this is a -- a difficult 3 audit to, um, conduct because it's mainly a cash basis. 4 Um, she's on a cash basis with collecting cash and 5 paying in cash. 6 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 7 MS. STEEL: A catering truck is like you bought 8 at the Culver City when we have the meetings. They are 9 so busy, especially when they have -- there's only one 10 person. How are they going to write receipts and, you 11 know, count money and -- it's very, very tough to do. 12 MR. LAMBERT: Right. 13 MS. STEEL: So maybe if -- I'm giving just 14 little idea about that observation test, that maybe 15 their route's been changed or how they got more sales 16 than before. And then how her mom was really -- how 17 much sick. And, you know, if you adjust those, I really 18 appreciate that. 19 MR. LAMBERT: Okay. 20 MS. STEEL: Because I know it's very tough to 21 do it because, you know, we have so many cases in Orange 22 County for I believe 48, almost 58 cases. So, you know, 23 we try to work with them. 24 And this is -- this is Mom and Pop store. This 25 is actually Mom store. There is just nobody else can 26 help her, so it's going to be very tough. But I hope 27 that, you know, we do observation test, we really 28 consider that, you know, her mom was sick and she was 19 1 not working full-time. She didn't have any help, and 2 all these has to be really adjusted. That's what I'm 3 asking actually. 4 MR. LAMBERT: Right. Ms. Steel, um -- 5 MR. HORTON: Excuse me. 6 MS. STEEL: Translate. 7 MR. HORTON: Translate, please. 8 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 9 MR. HORTON: Respond. 10 MR. LAMBERT: From an audit standpoint, my 11 response -- assuming that we confirm that in fact her 12 mother was sick, she had to stay home with her mother, 13 uh, to take care of her, she wasn't able to go as much, 14 what I would -- a way of doing this is basically taking 15 a comparison of '06 and '07, what was reported, and 16 comparing that to the periods, uh, in '08 and the first 17 quarter of '09. In other words, taking a percentage. 18 MS. STEEL: Right. 19 MR. LAMBERT: And you would figure if it was 20 underreported, it was probably underreported in the same 21 ratio -- 22 MS. STEEL: Right. 23 MR. LAMBERT: -- when we do our, uh, site 24 test. 25 MS. STEEL: And then maybe you can go to the 26 vendors that how many days that she really operated her 27 catering trucks. 28 MR. LAMBERT: Um, well, that's a good -- um, 20 1 that's one way of verifying whether, um -- 2 MS. STEEL: How many days she really worked. 3 MR. LAMBERT: Right. That's one way -- 4 MS. STEEL: Yeah. 5 MR. LAMBERT: -- of doing that. I'm just -- 6 MR. HORTON: Excuse me. 7 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 8 MS. STEEL: Okay. I'm done. Thank you. 9 Thank you. Oh -- 10 MR. LAMBERT: I was just going to -- I mean, 11 the only -- what you brought up is going there. But 12 what she said is, she'd -- she'd operate the truck but 13 for less hours, right. And so if you go there to say 14 did you purchase things, you'd really to have take a 15 look at the volume -- 16 MS. STEEL: Right. 17 MR. LAMBERT: -- that she was purchasing. 18 MS. STEEL: Right. Now and then. Maybe she 19 used to buy $200 worth, now she's buying 400. Then you 20 know that 50 percent increase. So you can just -- 21 MR. LAMBERT: Right. 22 MR. HANKS: We'd be happy to take a second look 23 at it -- 24 MS. STEEL: Okay. 25 MR. HANKS: -- and explore all those options. 26 MS. STEEL: Okay. Thank you. 27 MR. HORTON: Translate, please. 28 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 21 1 MR. HORTON: Further discussion, Members? 2 Did the Department explore the 6015 retailer? 3 Is that still in play? 4 MR. LAMBERT: Sixty -- 5 MR. HORTON: It's where the catering house is 6 considered a 6015 retailer, responsible for providing us 7 the information on the purchases? 8 MR. LAMBERT: Uh, we don't have any information 9 in that regard, but we can take a look at it. When 10 we -- when we talk to the catering house, then we can 11 get an idea of what -- what the relationship is, whether 12 it's, you know -- 13 MR. HORTON: Ongoing or -- 14 MR. LAMBERT: Well, her own truck or rented 15 truck or where the profits go. 16 MR. HORTON: Okay. 17 MR. LAMBERT: We can take a look at that. 18 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 19 MS. STEEL: Okay. But, you know, actually, um, 20 we have so many cases in Orange County, we were thinking 21 about catering house itself, you know, they pay sales 22 taxes if we can change the regulations. When catering 23 trucks goes out, they pay in advance to the catering 24 house, it's going to be much clearer for them. So 25 that's regulation we have to think about. 26 But I move, uh, to 30/30/30; is that good, 27 Mr. Levine? 28 MR. LEVINE: Um, I'd recommend just a reaudit. 22 1 MR. HORTON: Reaudit. 2 MS. STEEL: Reaudit. 3 MR. LEVINE: Sure. But I'd ask that the 4 Department talk with Petitioner right now with the 5 interpreter. 6 Appeals also, before we brought this to the 7 Board, since we recommended a reaudit, we also tried to 8 make contact and we had some trouble. And I'm sure 9 it's -- 10 MS. STEEL: Right. 11 MR. LEVINE: -- translation. But we have the 12 opportunity now, so maybe they can schedule it right 13 now. 14 MS. STEEL: Okay. 15 MR. HORTON: And, if possible, let's also have 16 a conversation about, uh, a payment plan, um, if -- in 17 anticipation that there possibly may be a liability, 18 just so that the taxpayer is aware that -- the other 19 options that are available to her. Maybe Mr. Gilman can 20 have a conversation with her while the translator's here 21 and share the various options that are available. 22 MR. LEVINE: I'm sure Mr. Gilman will be happy 23 to. He likes to talk. 24 MR. HORTON: Mr. Gilman, it's your turn. 25 Okay. There's a motion for a 30/30/30. Do I 26 hear a second -- 27 MS. STEEL: Reaudit. 28 MS. MANDEL: Reaudit. 23 1 MR. HORTON: Reaudit. Second from Ms. Mandel. 2 Without objection, such will be the order. 3 Thank you so very much for appearing before us 4 today. The Board will take your matter under -- well, 5 the Board has taken your matter under consideration. 6 We look forward to hearing back from you as 7 we -- after the reaudit. Thank you. 8 Please translate. 9 (Speaking in Vietnamese.) 10 MR. HORTON: Ms. Nguyen. 11 THE INTERPRETER: Yes. 12 MR. HORTON: Thank you as well. We truly 13 appreciate your service. 14 ---oOo--- 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 24 1 REPORTER'S CERTIFICATE 2 3 State of California ) 4 ) ss 5 County of Sacramento ) 6 7 I, KATHLEEN SKIDGEL, Hearing Reporter for the 8 California State Board of Equalization certify that on 9 December 15, 2011 I recorded verbatim, in shorthand, to 10 the best of my ability, the proceedings in the 11 above-entitled hearing; that I transcribed the shorthand 12 writing into typewriting; and that the preceding pages 1 13 through 24 constitute a complete and accurate 14 transcription of the shorthand writing. 15 16 Dated: January 12, 2012 17 18 19 ____________________________ 20 KATHLEEN SKIDGEL, CSR #9039 21 Hearing Reporter 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 25